Tolkien fans. question about Denethor (movies don't cover this)?

Question

I think this is more for the book fans than movie fans.
Denethor, the steward of Gondor at the time of the war, was driven insane by direct contact with Sauron. Gandalf made it clear (in the appendices, I think, more than in the story itself) that through most of his life Denethor was a fine leader. Almost in the category of Aragorn or another great king. Wise and strong. He was ruined and defeated in trying to use the palantir to learn whatever he could about Sauron and his plans. You'll recall the idea being that Sauron was able to get the better of him. This process bagan well before the ring started it's journey to Mordor. When Gandalf and Pippin, then Faramir arrived in Minas Tirith, Denethor pieced together the fact that the ring had been in reach of Gandalf and, for that matter, Boromir and he was furious with Gandalf for sending the ring to Mordor. There was at least one more occasion that Denethor looked into the palantir before his death. Considering that he was all

Answer 1

Sauron did not, at this point, know where the ring actually was. He assumed it was either in or on its way to Minas Tirith. Also, it never occured to him that anyone would want anything other than to use the ring for dominion therefore it would likewise never occur to him to coerce the plan for the ring out of Denethor. He thought he knew the plan; that men would use the his own ring against him. So his main objective was to drive Denethor into ultimate despair. That is his main weapon and all the characters battle with it. It is a major recurring theme throughout the book.



You also have to bear in mind that the palantiri were not mind control devices, they were merely instant long distance communication devices. Sauron could not control Denethor, merely lie to him in hopes of breaking his spirit, which he did. Denethor was a great man (much more so in the book than the movie) but Sauron was the master of deceit and with that he caused Denethor to finally give into despair.

Answer 2

Denethor was a very great man, and as you point out, of equal promise and ability as Aragorn. Remember how Aragorn was able, with great difficulty, to break Sauron's hold on the palantir and bring it under his control? Well, even though Denethor ends in despair, he was once of very strong mind, and there's no way that Sauron would be able to confront him directly and make contact with him without Denethor's knowledge. So Sauron has to twist what he shows Denethor in the palantir--always showing him the truth, but only part of the truth--without Denethor knowing that Sauron is controlling the images that the palantir reveals.



Even at the end, when Denethor is in grief and his mind is weakened, it's likely that Sauron could have broken him and caused him to go crazy, but not likely that Sauron could make him do something he didn't want to do. Getting Denethor to abandon the battle and take Faramir to the funeral pyre is a great blow to Gondor, so it's more useful to Sauron's cause if he leaves Denethor with enough mind to act on the twisted information he saw in the palantir.



I think the contrast between Denethor and Aragorn is a strong point of the books, not a weakness. Denethor represents men like Isildur, who are proud of their own strength and don't know enough to resist the temptations of power. Aragorn is a man who has the wisdom to resist the temptation, as well as the ability to join with others in a united front against Sauron.

Answer 3

I always thought Denethor didn't know he had been in contact with Sauron, and thought he was in control. He used the palantir to try to get an idea of what was going on, and Sauron twisted what he saw without Denethor's knowledge. That's why Sauron wasn't able to get the plans from Denethor's mind, because he had never been there to begin with.

Answer 4

well i like to see you write a better story.



highly doubtful.